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More on Soloing and Grouping in MMOGs
By Cameron Sorden | July 30, 2008
This seems to be a hot topic for quite a few of us in the blogosphere. Many people disagree with me vehemently and think that MMOGs don’t have much point without the grouping aspect. I wanted to revisit this and re-post a comment I left on Tobold’s blog this morning (since I know most people don’t keep going back and diving into comments):
After thinking about it for an evening, I still stand by my original post at Random Battle, though. I’m not suggesting a massive shift in the MMOG genre… I’m proposing a new form of MMO-like game.
As others have pointed out, here and elsewhere, some people don’t like grouping with others to kill monsters. Some people just want the massively multiplayer element for the social aspects that other live players bring to the game (as in Diablo 2, for example). Multiplayer doesn’t have to mean “killing together.” For some players, chatting and trading is enough. Adventuring is okay to do solo.
I don’t think providing that experience in a few games is necessarily a bad thing. It’s a different breed of MMOG, but that’s something a lot of us are hungry for, I think. Not a replacement, but another option.
I also still think that an MMOG which was mostly single-player in the field would open up all kinds of interesting gameplay options… meaningful NPC relationships, key enemies that stayed dead when killed, and more interesting environment options beyond just running around and killing stuff. You might be able to approach something along the lines of a proper Elder Scrolls style MMOG, in fact.
Variety is the spice of life, and it would be nice to have some options. I don’t see a problem with having a few games like this.
Topics: Random |
July 30th, 2008 at 11:22 am
Yes, and.. I really still don’t see why this cant exist with an MMO. Honestly, just because you killed bob the bartender or picked his pocket doesn’t mean he has to appear that way to another person. Keep bob the bartender’s state in a save file (could be on client or server but if its on client it makes it easier to exploit) and you have something more interesting than what we now have. /sigh the real problem is nobody is thinking outside the box.
July 30th, 2008 at 11:26 am
Ah, but that’s much messier… and somewhat confusing, in my opinion. Especially for new players. Why do we have to adventure together at all? Isn’t that thinking just as much outside the box as what you’re proposing, considering we have yet to see an MMO with that level of solo content?
If we’re all playing together in the same space and seeing different things, doing different things, and interacting with different things, what’s the point of it anyway? It’s like having a bunch of ghosts running around you.
July 30th, 2008 at 11:28 am
Thought experiment: The game you describe exists as either a completely single-player version without monthly fee, or as online multiplayer version with multiplayer interaction limited to chatting and the auction house for $15 per month. Would you pay the monthly fee?
I have nothing against good single-player RPGs. I just don’t want them to be monthly fee MMORPGs.
July 30th, 2008 at 11:33 am
Why would it have to have a monthly fee? ::grin::
Look at Guild Wars or the Diablo series. I’d think a game like this would work on that type of business model, and the players would pay for expanded content.
The $15/month fee is just one way to milk your customers.
However, since you bring it up… yes, I think I would, provided the content was strong enough. My issue with single player games is that there’s no persistence, no one to talk to, and no continuation of the game after you get to the end. An online component could fix all those things.
July 30th, 2008 at 12:17 pm
“Why do we have to adventure together at all?”
That’s the key to it all, I think. We should *want* to adventure together, rather than *have* to. A tricky poser to which I’m not sure I have any answers, but I’m pretty sure rare loot isn’t it.
July 30th, 2008 at 1:06 pm
@Thallian: that would be the equivalent of having randomly generated quests. Everyone would have their own unique quests, which in turn means no one has common quests, therefore what is the motive to group if you get nothing out of it?
@Tobold: “online multiplayer version with multiplayer interaction limited to chatting and the auction house for $15 per month” Those were called MUD’s, no? =D
@Cam: No persistence in single-player? Call me crazy, but if I kill the boss in a single player RPG, he stays dead. If I drop a nuke on the enemy city, that city is nuked. MMO’s keep preaching this illusion of persistence, but the reality is they’re completely static. I can kill this boss repeatedly (isn’t this a cornerstone of raiding?) I can kill this NPC or nuke this city (well, I wish…) and it respawns in 5 minutes or less. The only “persistence” is our characters; they reappear with all their progress each time we log back in. Although, that could be likened to having a “game save” in a single player game. Hell, even shooters these days like the Battlefield and COD4 have “persistent characters” to advance, rather than starting fresh from zero like the old ones did.
July 30th, 2008 at 1:11 pm
Scott: I should clarify what I mean. I’m talking about character persistence. In an MMOG, you get to keep and use the same character over very lengthy periods of time. There’s no reason your character advancement ever has to end, theoretically. You could take the same toon from the beginning of your game experience to four years down the line when you got tired of the game. It gives the illusion that your time invested has some continuing purpose from session to session, and it’s quite convincing.
That’s one of the key draws that MMOGs have always had over single player games for me.
July 30th, 2008 at 2:36 pm
First, MMOs attract gamers for more reasons than just the other players. The worlds are huge compared to single-player games, as are loot tables. There’s simply more to explore than in single-player games.
That said, the point of playing in the same gameworld as other players can potentially extend far, far beyond grouping. In the real world, individuals constantly affect the lives of others without direct contact. In fact, that’s the basis of modern economics.
In Shadowbane, I once wandered onto a smoldering ruin. There were no players around, but the burning buildings and broken walls I was viewing were the results of a seige that had taken place just a day or two before I arrived there.
The now extinct Trials of Ascension included many ways in which players could create gameplay for each other without ever meeting. For one example, a player could sacrifice the last of his lives to create a relic which would be randomly hidden in the world.
Simply watching other players run around helps to create the feeling of a living world. Multiplayer can mean so much more than merely grouping.
July 30th, 2008 at 5:47 pm
I want to group when pugs can finish an instance. We need Heroic, Normal and PUG settings for dungeons.
If we an MMO where pugs can’t complete dungeons with realative ease then you’ll need to bring on the solo component.
July 30th, 2008 at 6:12 pm
“Simply watching other players run around helps to create the feeling of a living world. Multiplayer can mean so much more than merely grouping.”
That is a great point Aaron. MMO’s can be viewed as single-player RPG’s that are more advanced because the other characters the player encounters are helping to bring that world to life by virtue of just being there and having more intelligence then the A.I. of a typical NPC.
Good MMO’s can work on all levels as elevated single-player RPG’s and as archetypal MMO’s.
August 11th, 2008 at 2:13 pm
[...] not convinced it’s going to be a long-term affair. As I’ve mentioned recently, I’m sick of the current MMOG model and I already like [...]
August 11th, 2008 at 2:13 pm
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